Support Group without Medical, but errors in ESA85

Firstly, thank you so much for the guides you provide and also this forum, which have been very helpful and supportive for me while anxiously awaiting the brown envelope to begin my migration from IB, stressing over filling out the ESA50 and waiting for the result.

I received the letter on Saturday and eventually found the result hidden near the bottom of page 1! As there was no indication of the length for my placement in support group i phoned on Monday to request an ESA 85A. To their credit, I received this today.

However, there are at least 2 errors in the report and I’m not sure whether to pursue them or leave things as they are for the two years of the award and would appreciate some advice. My concern is whether there are any ramifications for either my renewal application in 2 years (My problems are chronic and my functioning is likely to deteriorate, as my GP wrote) or my application for moving from DLA to PIP.

Obviously there is no great problem with the fact that I am identified as a man (As the client is a male, issues related to pregnancy are not relevant), beyond an indication of the lack of care/accuracy shown by the assessor. I may have an unusual first name, but my title is Ms and my GP referred to me as “she” a number of times in her report!

However, I am concerned that I am being described as being able to move with walking aids more than 50 metres, (Although the client has severe lower limb problems, the available evidence does not suggest that the client’s upper limb function is at a level which would prevent them moving with walking aids more than 50 metres....). I was very clear in the esa50 that I cannot use a wheelchair for as much as 50 metres before stopping due to pain and that I cannot repeatedly do it. With a stick I can only walk 10 metres. My GP letter also referred to a limited ability to use a wheelchair.

Should I just be “pleased” that I have limited capability for work with a prognosis of 2 years and leave things as they are?

rosedee wrote: Firstly, thank you so much for the guides you provide and also this forum, which have been very helpful and supportive for me while anxiously awaiting the brown envelope to begin my migration from IB, stressing over filling out the ESA50 and waiting for the result.

I received the letter on Saturday and eventually found the result hidden near the bottom of page 1! As there was no indication of the length for my placement in support group i phoned on Monday to request an ESA 85A. To their credit, I received this today.

However, there are at least 2 errors in the report and I’m not sure whether to pursue them or leave things as they are for the two years of the award and would appreciate some advice. My concern is whether there are any ramifications for either my renewal application in 2 years (My problems are chronic and my functioning is likely to deteriorate, as my GP wrote) or my application for moving from DLA to PIP.

Obviously there is no great problem with the fact that I am identified as a man (As the client is a male, issues related to pregnancy are not relevant), beyond an indication of the lack of care/accuracy shown by the assessor. I may have an unusual first name, but my title is Ms and my GP referred to me as “she” a number of times in her report!

However, I am concerned that I am being described as being able to move with walking aids more than 50 metres, (Although the client has severe lower limb problems, the available evidence does not suggest that the client’s upper limb function is at a level which would prevent them moving with walking aids more than 50 metres....). I was very clear in the esa50 that I cannot use a wheelchair for as much as 50 metres before stopping due to pain and that I cannot repeatedly do it. With a stick I can only walk 10 metres. My GP letter also referred to a limited ability to use a wheelchair.

Should I just be “pleased” that I have limited capability for work with a prognosis of 2 years and leave things as they are?

Hi rd,

Congratulations on the SG award, with a 2 year prognosis.

Well done on obtaining the ESA85A so quickly, as well.

Thanks for your kind comments about our site.

It is entirely up to you, on whether you wish to challenge any aspects of The ESA85A, however as you are not appealing the actual DM's decision, you would need to complain to ATOS :

Complaining to ATOS Healthcare

You should be aware though, that if, however unlikely it may be, the ESA85A was deemed unfit for purpose, it "could" result in you being reassessed.

Most reassessments are looked at in a standalone capacity, in other words, it is highly unlikely that the ATOS HCP doing your reassessment in circa 2 years time will read the ESA85A from this assessment.

Does the ESA85A state which of The Schedule 3 SG Descriptors you qualified under ? :

SG (LCWRA) Descriptors

ESA Reg 35 for entry to The SG (LCWRA)

bro58

thank you Gordon and bro58 for your replies.

After reading bro's response, I thought it would probably be best to leave well alone. However, Gordon's then gave me pause for further thought.

I am currently on Higher rate mobility DLA, awarded indefinitely. I certainly don't want to jeopardise my application for PIP when it comes.

If it was used in the future, would it be too late to contest it then, using the obvious errors of fact, such as my sex, to support the lack of accuracy in the report?

The ESA85a does not specify which descriptors I qualify under per se. Under justification of advice it states:
The available evidence suggests that the client has a significant level of disability due to cervical/lumbar problems such that they would have limited capability for work.
Ehlers Danlos Syndrome.
It then specifically goes through all the criteria in Reg 35 1 & 2 and says that I don't meet them.
It then lists each descriptor and says I don't meet it.

I'm starting to wonder whether someone has made a mistake. Although the Advice states that I meet the criteria for having limited capability for work, the justification doesn't support this.....

When I requested the esa85a, I also asked for a written statement of reasons for their decision (I had thought that this would be something from DWP rather than ATOS) but are they in fact the same thing?

I should add that I do meet the criteria to be in the support group! My mobility alone qualifies me for it; I also have points in other categories and would meet the criteria for Reg 35 (2) (b)

rosedee wrote: thank you Gordon and bro58 for your replies.

After reading bro's response, I thought it would probably be best to leave well alone. However, Gordon's then gave me pause for further thought.

I am currently on Higher rate mobility DLA, awarded indefinitely. I certainly don't want to jeopardise my application for PIP when it comes.

If it was used in the future, would it be too late to contest it then, using the obvious errors of fact, such as my sex, to support the lack of accuracy in the report?

The ESA85a does not specify which descriptors I qualify under per se. Under justification of advice it states:
The available evidence suggests that the client has a significant level of disability due to cervical/lumbar problems such that they would have limited capability for work.
Ehlers Danlos Syndrome.
It then specifically goes through all the criteria in Reg 35 1 & 2 and says that I don't meet them.
It then lists each descriptor and says I don't meet it.

I'm starting to wonder whether someone has made a mistake. Although the Advice states that I meet the criteria for having limited capability for work, the justification doesn't support this.....

When I requested the esa85a, I also asked for a written statement of reasons for their decision (I had thought that this would be something from DWP rather than ATOS) but are they in fact the same thing?

Hi rd,

Gordon is indeed correct, however you should take into account that DLA Mobility is a walking test, and ESA Moving Around (Mobilising) includes the use of a manual wheelchair unaided.

So it is a decision that you will have to make.

"The ESA85a does not specify which descriptors I qualify under per se. Under justification of advice it states:
The available evidence suggests that the client has a significant level of disability due to cervical/lumbar problems such that they would have limited capability for work."

This statement only puts you in The WRAG.

" Ehlers Danlos Syndrome.
It then specifically goes through all the criteria in Reg 35 1 & 2 and says that I don't meet them.
It then lists each descriptor and says I don't meet it."

This statement seems to be stating that you do not fulfill ESA Reg 35, (Exceptional Circumstances Rules) for entry to The SG (LCWRA)

There is nothing that you have written, that would indicate that the ATOS HCP recommends that you should be placed into The SG.

It only indicates a recommendation of WRAG (LCW)

You could write to the DWP in the form of a SAR and specifically ask for information of the criteria that placed you into The SG.

There should also be an LT54 Form, as seen here :

ESA Forms

ESA medical – what forms to ask for?

You can download a SAR, from here :

www.dwp.gov.uk/docs/request-for-personal-information.rtf

From this page :

www.dwp.gov.uk/privacy-policy/data-protection/


You should take into account that The DWP DM does not have to follow ATOS's recommendations in The ESA85A, especially if you have provided other compelling evidence.

bro58